Published Issue 132, December 2024
Part band. Part film producers. Part SNL level comedy sketch artists. Part existential therapists. Part … magicians? The impliers aren’t just a psych-dream pop-electro duo. Or even a comedy act. They’re a fully self-taught, self-produced multimedia entity and concept band who create expert level visual and sonic content and deeply meaningful work, all through the lens of not taking life so seriously.
Born creatives, Denver-based Dan Hartman and North Carolina-based Charles Ingram unite as the impliers not for accolades or stardom or even just to jam — but because they have no choice but to make art. Sure, it’s a nice side effect that they’ve won multiple awards for their music and videos alongside brands such as Netflix, HBO and PBS, and organizations like the Denver 48 Hour Film Festival. And that their 2022 debut album, Cocoon, received high praise and worldwide traction for their following. But in the grand scheme, Dan and Charles are just trying to use their innate artistic gifts to talk about things that people experience but don’t usually admit or say out loud, in hopes of creating a safe space for all who need it to explore the scope of our feelings in the world we live in together, and ultimately to spread some light.
I had the chance to catch up with the pair to talk about their 3-part upcoming release, The Magic, and to dive a little deeper into the magic tricks they have up their sleeves, but are willing to share, that make the experience of being human on this planet a little bit more fun.
You both met at the ripe age of 15 in North Carolina. Now you’re in a full-blown project together with several awards and impressive experiences like having music released on compilations alongside Fugazi, Of Montreal and Jawbreaker. How did the concept of the impliers come about?
Dan: We came up in this active and energetic punk/metal scene in NC and were the only band playing spaced out indie music and the scene really embraced it. We’d regularly play with JRS (Tony from Municipal Waste) and The Kickass (Bennie from Valient Thorr) at a skatepark that regularly packed crowds of 100+ kids — Future Islands started there. We felt on the cusp of something special, but in that teenage phase we had plenty of distractions and stopped playing live altogether. We still independently made things, collecting enough equipment to build these small home studios and for the next few decades, we each did solo music for our own enjoyment and banked tons of unreleased music. We never lost sight of the spark when the two of us collaborated, and we continued to send one another music and got together to film weird sketch comedy. I always had ambitions to start doing things more purposefully, and one day in 2019, I texted Charles, “You and I have a new band. The name of the band is ‘the impliers.’” And he said, “Okay. It’s good to have the name out of the way,” and we started putting together the songs that made our first album, Cocoon.
The impliers initially comes off as pure comedy gold and tongue-in-cheek musical performance. But upon scratching the surface there’s a serious undertone and compassionate depth to your work. Your 2022 debut, Cocoon, spotlighted fundamental issues spanning from mental health conditions to relationship complexities to mortality salience to a scope of existential questions. Comedy often serves as a safe space and vehicle to communicate vital and hard life topics. But how do you balance the two in order to successfully get your points across and also make the art you want to make?
Dan: That’s a really good question. We each grew up as the class clowns in our friend group making people laugh (and mostly still are). As we got older, our collaboration turned exclusively toward sketch comedy, really just to make our families and friends crack up. There’s a healing element in comedy, we have so much fun with the whole process … we laugh the entire time coming up with an idea, writing it, filming it, and the whole way we’re just losing it. People’s outer shells are usually lighter than their inside personalities, but we tend to display our insides a lot on the outside and that comes out in the art. We’re both known for deep hours long conversations as much as laughing about crazy ideas. So being deeply moved by music, comedy and film — those arts are where we naturally developed our storytelling. So we take advantage of that full range for the things we want to do. Sometimes it blends — Cocoon is deep and covers tough to swallow topics, but the promo for the album is a total spoof infomercial, which felt like a good format to quickly and simply share the essence of the whole album.
Cocoon LP Informercial – 2023 Silver Telly Award Winner for Social Video
As a concept record band, can you dive a bit deeper into the concept approach and also why you took a slight turn with your sound on your new 3-part album, The Magic? (And also why it’s been compared to a collaboration between Prince and Trent Reznor, because according to legitimate streaming service stats, I’m a top Reznor listener/fan in the world 😉
Dan: Okay, that is a huge accomplishment, so I’m more interested in what you think here! The Prince and Trent Reznor feel emerged from the combination of pop elements like top-line melodies, falsetto vocals with lots of harmonies blended with dark synths and basslines with drums that can have an industrial feel. But we’d change that to “If Prince and NIN made SNL digital shorts.” On the concept question: from the very beginning we agreed our whole output would be one concept. It’s a sketched out 6-installment story arc. The upcoming album series, The Magic, is Installment 3 and it’s broken out like a movie into three acts with each song being scenes. Cocoon was Part 2 of 2 of Installment 5. The idea was to start with an ideal end state, finite vision while creating a way to account buckets for all the sounds and themes we want to explore in a way that would be compelling for us to create and others to consume.
Charles: The sound is definitely a pivot for the audience, but not so much for us as we have each made songs in the genre of metal, hip-hop, classical, jazz and sometimes we just feel it’s best to use something like Yacht Rock. And it WAS important for us to come out with our new sound immediately after Cocoon came out for ourselves to be able to operate in the whole available range, especially without misleading fans. We’re not Korn or ACDC or Beach House or Migos who do their specific thing so well every time. We’re not something for everyone, and some people may just like one song, and some people may love dissecting the puzzle we’re laying out. We do lose a few fans when we shift and we get it and that’s okay. We don’t like it when bands that we like change sometimes, but we also like bands like Ween who changed on most songs.
Part 1 of The Magic centers on the exploration of romantic love in all facets: the good, the bad, and the ugly. Please expand.
Dan: The concept of love is an important one. Everyone experiences it at some level, and that comes with the biggest elation and also heartbreak, so the type of music is a good way to communicate that. In music, love songs are so prominent. On the good side, there’s so much of the fuzzy side of how in love you are and so it’s fun to cover those wonderful and sometimes naive feelings. But on the tough side, love songs are so often about being a victim or suffering because of losing a relationship, or because the other person was such a problem. But sometimes, aren’t we the problem? Have you ever screwed up a relationship you really wanted to keep, or ended one the wrong way? We have, and assume most people have, but those stories are hard to admit, and harder to admit honestly and end up sanitized. There’s a low understanding of what it looks like on the inside of anxious or avoidant attachment styles that feels urgent to talk about. These are the things people feel and think or experience but don’t usually say. Ideally, someone could turn on these lighter songs and feel energized, and maybe think, It’s not just me; or Hmm, I think this might be what my partner experiences; or even one step further, Wow, I’ve known I should end this relationship and now I have the guts to do it. In relationships, instead of communicating feelings sometimes people just do the dishes loudly to initiate the conflict they want to confront. So in a way, hopefully this is a tool for them. And the bad can be beautiful too. In Colorado people talk about “Type 2 fun,” which is when you get your ass kicked on something like climbing a mountain, and then afterward your brain deletes all the bad and you are left with this positive memory. On the flip side, when these big relationships that contain many of the VERY best parts of your life sours, all the good stuff can get deleted and you are left with a shitty memory. But the good stuff still happened, and you still grew. So we also highlight the growth side.
What can fans and those new to your group look forward to in tandem with this release?
Dan: Big feelings of course, but a handful of topical sketch comedy videos. We’ve got a short sitcom format video that introduces a special character by the name of “Bingo” who stars in one of the music videos we’re in the process of producing, as well as a relationship advice video from self-renowned author Docter Charles. You’ll see some musical styles you’ve not yet heard from us, and more session musicians! We’ve been experimenting hiring super talented folks to interpret crazy instructions, like we did with horns on the last few singles — notably the sax player on “Make Your Move” is Jesse Molloy (who we later learned is from Panic! At The Disco).
Love At First Site music video by the impliers
Who are you channeling for your impliers alter egos and how do these ideas typically come about?
Dan: We’ve filmed so much solo sketch comedy that characters were often born out of the need to have more than one person on video. So we’d just play all the characters ourselves. If you watch the intro to the “Love At First Sight” music video, you’ll see a handful of characters we’ve created over the years. The alter egos you see on our website and in the “Make Your Move” video stemmed from the idea that when people go to a club on the prowl, they dress and act in a way that isn’t truly them! AND, the person they meet is also doing the same thing. So when these two people meet, it is like at least four people in the conversation. And if they hit it off? So begins the melting away of the facade … or even funnier, some people just stay like that forever. Like the guys that have an unnaturally cool walk, or a fake deep voice. So these guys are the most opposite versions of ourselves. So the ideas come out as a side effect of the concept of the song or sound we’re making, and this is one of those places where we really think about the fanbase. We just love the idea of going the extra mile in making it worth your time to catch up with our new material as it comes out. And, it just gives us a reason to crack ourselves and our Moms up.
Lonely Meets The Only music video by the impliers
What does band practice look like with you two living in separate states?
Dan: There is no practice, I don’t play outside of recording! I traded depth of skills for width a long time ago and just being good enough to get songs out of my brain. This means I regularly have to record a part 40 plus times to get it right, because I’ve not played a guitar in four months if I have been working on mixing, lyrics, videos, etc. This also means I regularly have to stop for a week to finish a part so my non-calloused bloody finger can heal.
Charles: Every weekend when I turn on my studio, I make a new “blip” which is the fastest song I can make to keep it fun and interesting. Then we will take parts of these for songs and videos, and I also use these for the scores to the films we do. I jam with my brother on weekends and we take songs from Pixies or Big Black or Dead Milkmen and try to play them in different genres.
What’s an impliers memory that never gets old?
Charles: In 2019, I landed in Denver and we glued on some fake beards and got in full costume and wandered around to talk to strangers in these different looks, yet completely ourselves. They just interacted with us as normal, which was awesome. Then we found a puppet and made a video about puppet therapy. Then we got identical clothes and mustaches and filmed a choreographed dance video which scenes ended up in our “Make Your Move” music video. Then we went back out and accidentally ended out at Blue Ice for the free Salsa dancing night where a nice middle-aged woman asked me for one last dance. This was a Tuesday.
Recall a tough lesson in your creative journey that made your individual work and collaboration together stronger?
Dan: When bands break up you lose all the songs. We were in three bands together that ended. When you learn how to do self-production, that never happens as you create a solo library. As we each did solo production, we came out of the next decade with our own unique styles that were very different from one another, and over time, our influences became more ourselves and one another than anything external. Now when we come together, it’s more about blending individual styles and we have a huge shortcut in our communication — we know how to disagree in a super healthy, unemotional way. We did come out of the other end of these solo journeys with just piles and piles of parts we draw from occasionally. For example, we are working on a song right now for The Magic, Part 1 called “Alive” that was started 19 years ago, using as much of the originally recorded tracks as we possibly can.
What is your go-to during an artistic block?
Dan: Well, a few things. The first is being hyperaware of not assigning the idea of being blocked! Some times are for ideas flowing, others are for experiencing life, or being lazy, so if it doesn’t come, then we try not to force it. It’s kind of like when you can’t sleep and the more you think about it the harder it gets! I like how writers say write a little bit every day and sometimes you get on a run! But also, sometimes sitting in a studio when there isn’t an idea and trying to force it can build a sense of resentment towards going into the studio. Instead, do something else and don’t even try.
That being said, there are many things you can do! For music, you can genre flip. Maybe you take a song you were working on that was acoustic and instead re-record it as a Four-on-the-floor club song. Make up a new guitar tuning that breaks everything you know. Try to make something intentionally bad, or ridiculous, or in a genre you hate. If writing music isn’t coming, do lyrics come? Maybe tweaking levels and effects? Sometimes if you just sit down and play a track you have been making from the beginning, you might start noticing little tweaks and then fall into two hours of flow mixing and then you get a new part. When you do get the free flow of ideas that happens when it happens … catch ‘em! Write them all down, whistle into your phone, write down scenes and jokes, or whatever it is, and then when you want to create but it’s not coming, tap into that bank. There is much better advice about this stuff in books like The War of Art, which you could read in an hour, or The Creative Act by Rick Rubin, which directly has advice for this, or Flow which literally has instructions on the conditions to get in the zone.
But honestly, try to understand where the pressure is coming from? A lot of times it is one simple thing, and that thing may very well be that you are just thinking about what other people will think.
What is your reason for making art in the first place? How do you stay inspired all these years?
Charles: Close your eyes, and think about the piece or music or video that moved you the most, ever. That is why. I always have thought that if I could make even just a few people feel the same way I felt from music, it’s all worth it.
Dan: More and more I’ve learned that you need people that are here spreading light in the world, on social media, wherever — giving people things to sing and dance to, to laugh at, and to make you think and wonder beyond where your borders are today. Do you ever consider that you can think literally ANY thought? ANY THING EVER. And you can think it right now. And further, being able to take something that only existed in your mind and make it a thing that exists somehow in reality and is experienced by someone else’s senses is absolutely beautiful. But another thing that emerged once we released our music was the many people that reached out to us saying they’re moved by our music and lyrics. One unexpected one was from young men, especially in Latin America, that were saying things like, “I heard your lyrics and they are exactly how I feel. I have not heard a male talk about this.” And so that was touching knowing someone that may be less likely to reach out for help felt heard and understood. But most of all, we still mainly make stuff for our family and friends to laugh at and listen to.
Top three albums.
Charles: Swans — Soundtracks for the Blind; Propagandhi — Less Talk More Rock; Sonic Youth — Sister
Dan: Cornelius — Fantasma; Fredrik Thordendal’s Special Defects’s Sol Niger Within; Mew — And The Glass Handed Kites
Top three films.
Charles: Apocalypse Now, Blue Velvet, Gummo
Dan: Mulholland Drive, Taxi Driver, Memento
Top performers.
Dan & Charles: Laddio Bolocko – Completely BLEW our minds in any way. Swans — Do not miss them, ever. Ever. 2000s era Mike Patton. Tigran Hamasyan Trio.
Go-to fashion item(s).
Charles: Dad Asics.
Dan: I bought every color of one pair of sweatpants that look like normal pants on a sale called “Daymaker.”
Favorite mustache styles.
Charles: John Waters mustache, specifically his mustache.
Dan: Rusty Jones.
One piece of tech you’d love to see have a comeback.
Charles: Payphones and Super Soakers
Dan: Super soakers are still around FYI
Check out more music, videos & art: Website | Instagram | YouTube | Spotify (exclusive)
Check out their latest music video: Make Your Move
Krysti Joméi is the co-owner and co-founder of Birdy Magazine. Creating in Colorado for the past decade plus, she’s lived all around San Francisco, by Houston’s NASA, on an island across from Seattle, near the WA/Canadian border, and under the Nandi Hills in Kenya. She loves outer space, the ocean, running in nature, anything written by Trent Reznor, and adventuring with her partner, Jonny, husky and black cat.
Head to our Explore section to see more past interviews and work by Krysti.